AS83: Category 5 Shitstorms, with James Lindsay

This week I have James Lindsay on the show, @goddoesnt on Twitter, to discuss the recent shitstorm that resulted from Peter Boghossian’s tweets. This is a chance to talk at a deeper level about what’s going on when these shitstorms happen. Does the phrase “gay pride” make sense? If so, is it the most effective slogan? Should it be changed in order to avoid negative connotations that the word “pride” carries? And most importantly, are these questions simply too offensive/ignorant/hateful for two straight white guys to discuss? I sure hope not!

4 thoughts on “AS83: Category 5 Shitstorms, with James Lindsay”

  1. Honestly, I’m still pissed about the Sam Harris “sexist” argument, so I’ll use this “shitstorm” episode as a second chance to vent.

    Sam Harris is NOT the sexist pig she was looking for! That journalist ran a hit piece on him to garner attention and he was moved by the accusation to respond in a less-than-detached way.

    You have said that you are a Harris fan, and so am I. I am actually rather passionate in my fandom of Harris, because he has demonstrated an amazing ability to cut right to the heart of controversial matters and find the clear, unvarnished truth. Unfortunately, many people like their truth well varnished!!

    Whether it is his frank discussion of the problems with Islam or his inartful comments on the male preference for conflict over consensus, I trust that Sam Harris’ heart and mind are in the right place, and I give him the benefit of the doubt.

    Dawkins showed his complete lack of understanding of the constant guarded fear of violence that women have to deal with when he downplayed “elevatorgate.” Sam did no such thing! No comparison, and I would like to have seen a less-balanced approach to his “sexist pig” controversy. I thought he was clearly innocent of any sexist intent and his motives were, as always, pure and straightforward.

    Thanks for listening.

  2. I’ve never had a problem with the use of the word. Essentially society is telling people they should be ashamed of being gay, or black, and they are saying I’m not ashamed I’m proud. Whenever I hear someone saying they find it offensive, or arguing that people who say it are trying to say they are better than heterosexuals, my homophobe/racist meter is triggered. When that happens it serves a purpose, it allows me to explain why it’s OK to use Gay Pride, Black Pride, but not Heterosexual pride, or white pride.
    Saying you’re proud to “say that your gay” doesn’t really fit with the intent. “I’m proud to say that I’m gay” means I’m not ashamed to say it, not that I’m not proud to be it. I mean would it fit to say “I’m proud to say that I’m black”? I think not.

  3. Finally, I feel like saying to myself “these are the skeptics you’re looking for”. Reason has gone out the window in the last place it should: the community of reason! This podcast is free from the echo chamber and I hope it remains so. Thank you for your work. Beware, though, criticism = mysogyny and/or racism and/or homophobia in certain circles so expect backlash.

    Kristen, it’s heartwarming to hear your take on the Harris BS. Yet another example of the morality and tone police, the intellectual dishonest, trying to defame one of atheism/reason’s strongest, most articulate voices for personal gain (measured in clicks and lecture fees) by being as least charitable and OTT reactionary as possible. The h word applies too but its use is liable to break the internet.

    Although I do disagree, Kristen, about elevatorgate, which to me was the Rubicon crossing of a megaphonically vocal minority. From elevatorgate to gamergate to shirtgate: it’s utterly devastating the lengths to which some of these idealogues will stoop.

    Re: gay pride. As a gay man, I appreciate the discussion and see it as a lot of smoke. Unfortunately the time just hasn’t come when it no longer makes sense to have gay pride (or black history month, etc.)

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